|
ESL Forum:
Techniques and methods
in Language Teaching
Games, activities
and teaching ideas
Grammar and
Linguistics
Teaching material
Concerning
worksheets
Concerning
powerpoints
Concerning online
exercises
Make suggestions,
report errors
Ask for help
Message board
|
ESL forum >
Message board > To Reporters and Moderators
To Reporters and Moderators
|
goodnesses
|
To Reporters and Moderators
|
Good Afternoon Everybody;
First, let me say that I am very sorry for myself because I am breaking a promise I made to myself that is not to participate directly in the forum for some personal reasons. However, the argument going on on the reporting section forced me to do so in order to put an end to a confusing situation where many members where unfairly sanctioned.
To do so I am going just to post the message (with some correction LOL) I put their in the reporting section in case most of the moderators wouldn �t have seen it since it is about to be pushed out.
Dear colleagues I have just received a
message from Victor saying that he agrees with me that we are going a
little farther than necessary when applying this rule about the usage of L1 as a support in our WS. I thought to
post it in its integrity on the forum, but finally refrained because I find it
irrespectful towards him. What I beg you to do now, not for this WS, (BTW
this is the only one of the sort I have on the site ie; I don�t care
about it being removed or not this is not my point. Just a note for
those who seem not understand my objective yet), but for the coming
reported ones, is to refrain voting (I don�t say vote one way or
another) until Victor put it as he promised clearly and visibly for everbody UNLESS
the WS has completely nothing to do with teaching English and you are
sure that absolutely no teacher of English would find it useful. Thank you
very much and sorry the ones I respect a lot if I were offending or too direct at a
moment, no respect for the others (they know themselves) who are turning
this necessary tool for the site into a vindictive compaign. Because
reporting a WS we come across while browsing the site looking for
interesting ones is something that is completely different from going
chasing, hunting, pursuing WS pretending it is our job. Reporting and voting
aren�t a job assigned to someone it is an option to help keep the site
clean. A duty yes, a job no. Goodbye every body on this section. I will
not participate in it whatever you decide to do about Victor�s
message. That message is enough for me.
And this an example to illustrate my point of: How come we delete a WS meant to teach a certain point in the English just because it contains the equivallent Voc. in the L1 though we see clearly that it turns to be very useful for many members.
Here is the example:
Irregular Nouns Plurals. (Author-Bouabdellah) |
Date: 28 - Jun - 2009
Level:intermediate
Age: +14
|
Description:
Complete Organized List Of Irregular Nouns Plurals. With L1
equivallents to help SS with the less common ones. The L1 can easily be
replaced by your own L1 if necessary. Hope you�ll find it useful!
Download this worksheet (this is your own worksheet, so you can download it free of charge)
Downloads: 19
Comments (3) -
Send a comment
|
|
|
Is this worksheet copied from another
website or publication?
Isn �t it an ESL resource?
Is the file corrupted or empty?
Please
report it!
|
Comments on this worksheet |
|
|
Just have a look to the number of downloads in less than 7 hours and the comments left on it.
Thank all.
My best regards to all the respectful members
Sorry for taking so much space the issue is very important and the hard work of many people depend on it.
Bouabdellah.
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
|
goodnesses
|
BTW; this is in no way advertising. I am going to remove this WS definitely as soon as the message has passed what ever the number of downloads it would have until then.
Thanks
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
cheezels
|
I have not participated in the discussion in the moderating section. But I would like to ask you where do you draw the line? I speak and teach English. I can understand that a vocabulary list with L1 language can and are useful to many.
HOWEVER I personally HATE downloading a worksheet to find another language other than English on it. Especially if it is the instructions as maybe there is a specific task for the worksheet and I have no idea what was originally meant. Or even worse that there is a lot throughout the worksheet.
So if the rule is some then how much is some- this opens up a whole can of worms that needs to be addressed. For me as an English speaker and teacher I would hope that site site remains solely an ENGLISH resource site. I really do not see why an english only worksheet cannot be submitted and in the description if you want the original spanish/english version or whatever language version you can PM each other. English is the common thread here... in my humble opinion allowing other languages is just going to create more problems than solve them as the site continues to grow.
This is only my opinion.
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
Zora
|
I see no problem in allowing SOME first language in worksheets.
I mean, and we are being extremely hypocritical here, for the simple fact - a while ago some word lists that were in Spanish and English were allowed to stay. Now, it turns out some of those same people are voting to remove similar sheets but in other languages!
There is nothing wrong with some first language on English worksheets - they are extremely useful for remedial students or for take home activities like I like to send at the end of the year so they can do them at home and by themselves.
We are being EXTREMELY closed minded about teaching methods. One way may work well for some but not for another.
For example: I do use F1 in my class at times and guess what? The students I have have gotten top marks on official and state exams... SO does that mean, I am wrong in my way of teaching??? No, it just means I prefer a more dynamic class that moves quickly without me having to pantomime my way through concepts...and we can get down to "the important and fun stuff"...
I saw the fights, the discussions on the board and I just shook my head... - we are adults, not kids. And we need to respect each other and stop NITPICKING!
It is NOT fair that some members are forgiven because "things were different back then" and others aren �t!!! There are members here who are fine tooth combing older printables and some members are forgiven - especially ones with a distinct layout - and others are voted for removal. It �s hypocritical to say the least....
I have almost stopped voting altogether, because honestly things are getting out of hand - AGAIN!
First language has been proven to be effective in a classroom if kept at a minimum. And all people need to do is SAY so on the worksheet. Say it has F1 in it.... but then again, maybe they shouldn �t because it will only get reported!
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
zailda
|
I agree with cheezels because if we open the site for the first language, we �ll open it for hundreds of languages, in fact. The language all of us have in common here is English and if someone wants a description, explanation or anything else in his/her native language, it �s better to add it after downloading. This way the wss are useful for everyone, not just for the teachers who speak the same language.
I don �t download wss with 2 languages, even Portuguese, because they aren �t useful for me. But the important thing is not whether they are useful or not, any ws in English will be useful for someone, the matter is that the site has rules and I didn �t see anywhere here that another language is allowed.
If Victor thinks that another language must be allowed it �s OK for me, since he �s the site �s owner, but I think that if he wants that, it �ll be easy for him to express his opinion.
Besides, if another language is allowed, we �ll need more regulations: how much? where? only translations? explanations in other or both languages allowed? with a warn in the description? another section for them? what about the old ones? and so on...
For now, the wise thing to do is to upload wss only in English, deleting the mother tongue �s part, until we have a diverse Victor �s statement. Until there, I �m afraid people will keep reporting the wss and they �ll be in risk of being removed.
Have a nice Monday.
Zailda Coirano
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
txellalalluna
|
with all due respects and with my peace pipe on hand
i completely agree with zora and the spirit of the post.
I believe the rules say that
resources have to be in English,
rules don �t say they have to be IN ENGLISH ONLY
and i don �t understand why you can hate to download a worksheet you don �t understand when there is a preview and it is probably explained in the description of the worksheet.
99.9% of daily uploads are in english - very often a 100% - and probably even those very few that include another language can be easily edited in case someone wanted to use a different L1 - which is why 2 of the 3 thanks comments on the post are from non-arabic speakers...
no need to pannic, "foreign" languages are not going to take over eslprintables.com
each teacher shares whatever works in his/her groups or with some of their students, i don �t think anyone intends to upload materials no annoy anyone. we all upload our best pieces of work thinking other teachers may find them useful.
shall we smoke the pipe together?
txell
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
cheezels
|
I would also like to point out that I consider VOCABULARY LISTS different from WORKSHEETS.
As I said in my original post I can and do understand the usefulness of those. BUT in actual worksheets it is annoying to find L1 language. How would everyone like it if I started uploading English worksheets with a splattering of Swedish throughout? So that everyone can benefit it would be only fair that it was English. Also there was a suggestion way back that L1 language could be included in a page at the back so that it was extra for those that would benefit.
I have stayed out of the war of the words in the moderating forum and I do not wish to get into one here.
But one thing I think we all agree on is that we need to have a calm discussion and of course hear what Victor has to day. A compromise could be that Vocabulary lists could be in L1 language and English could stay (special section?) but the worksheets remain in English.
I know that there have been really interesting things the last few months that I have thought would be really useful to me until I saw that there was another language for the instructions (for example) or the bit the explains the activity... which for me renders it useless.
Light that pipe txell 
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
victor
|
|
I know I made the rule, but I �ve seen worksheets or powerpoints that become senseless if they are fully translated to English language:
Bilingual lists
Translate into English
Join the English words with their translation in your mother language.
etc.
For example, if I find an exercise in which students have to match Phrasal verbs in English with their meaning in French, it would be easy for me to change the words in French into Spanish.
On the other hand, I find no reason to include explanations or instructions in other languages. We should write them in English, and every teacher can translate them to their own language if they want.
It is not our role to judge if these are good methods or not. Each user can see the preview and decide if the worksheet is useful for him/her.
As I said before, it is impossible to set clear rules for everything. We always have to draw a line between what is allowed or not. Sometimes moderators will have to do that according to their own feelings. A good way would be to think: "What would happen if all users send contributions like this? Would it harm the website?" If the answer is yes, then it should be removed, otherwise it should stay.
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
txellalalluna
|
worksheets in English with translations into languages that are not mine can even help me when i teach a big group where some students are newcomers - children who´ve just arrived in the country - and i don´t have time enough to mime for them specifically or we have no language to communicate yet. It could be on the title, and that would avoid unnecessary downloads...
there´s so many different situations in the world of teaching....
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
johanne23232
|
As I �ve written several times in the past, I think it would be only fair that if L1 worksheets are posted, then the language that is included in it should be stated clearly in the title of the worksheet so that each one of us can decide whether this is something we are interested in. For example, in this particularly worksheet, the title could be
IRREGULAR NOUNS PLURAL (WITH ARABIC TRANSLATIONS)
I �m sure that would not only avoid �mistaken � downloads, but would even attract Arabic speakers who might benefit from this particular ws.
If L1 work is to be permitted, perhaps Victor could add this stipulation to the rules?
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
|
mena22
|
|
Hi! I �ve been refraining from taking part in this discussion because I �m overworked and I really don �t feel like getting into a battle field, which, in my opinion, is exactly what the reported contributions page looked like these last days due to the dilemma - bilingual worksheets or not.
The way I vote, and I know it happens to many of you, may not have anything to do with the way I think. I vote according to the rules, first because they exist for some reason and, second, because I believe everybody should be treated in the same way, what will only happen if we use the same criteria in a similar situation. That is why I have been voting for the removal of worksheets that have a second language.
The fact that I �ve been voting for the removal of bilingual worksheets is based on the rule we can see when we upload a worksheet: "Your contributions must be in English Language." "Must" is a pretty strong verb and for me there has been so far one only interpretation of this rule - that we have to upload our work in English.
This has nothing to do with the use of our language in the classroom. I have nothing against it and I do know that sometimes it is highly pedagogical to use the mother tongue with our students. However, one thing is to use it in the classroom, when we find it appropriate, and a totally different thing is to share our work in an international site with it.
Many of us do not upload or download bilingual worksheets but if victor finds it should be accepted, then the only thing he has to do is to clarify the rule and tell us about it so that we know what to do as moderators. We will vote based on the rules as we have always done.
Wish you a nice day.
mena
|
29 Jun 2009
|
|
1
2
3
4
5
Next >
|
