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ESL forum >
Message board > Rocking the Boat
Rocking the Boat
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Bruna Dutra
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Coming back to Linda �s original intention... this is a perfect picture of what she meant, I guess.
Zailda, if you allow me to disagree with you in one point, and I know that a wise person like yourself does, this is not a family... for the simple matter that a family does not expel anyone. And we do. This is a community. And as a community there are problems that have to be dealt. But also and again, the final word belongs to Victor, who cannot for human reasons solve all the troubles that we have everyday. Therefore, we all should try and do the best we could for the site �s sake.
You didn �t ask for my advice I know, but reading your opinion I also remembered an important saying: "An eye for and eye and the whole world ends up blind".
I expect everyone to be nice to me, but even when they aren �t, there �s nothing better than replying rudeness with kindness, and nothing makes the world brighter and the "attacker" more disturbed by his/her own behavior. When people are rude to me for free, I �m kind to them for free too, because nothing makes them think and rethink more about their attitudes.
I hope you get my point.
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21 Jan 2010
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zailda
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I admire you for being so nice at all times. Unfortunatelly I am not. I use the same people use, and they should think of it, if they want to attack me and not be attacked back.
This is my nature, and it �s the way I managed to survive, so I don �t want to change, sorry. We are all different and people should respect the differences. If I �m different from you, I think it �s not enough to attack me, isn �t it right?
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21 Jan 2010
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juliag
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Hi everyone,
I �ve only been a member for 2-3 months so I can �t compare with what the site was like before, but I must say that in the short time here I �ve been frequently amazed by the kindness, generosity, and support of other members here, and have felt also a greater degree of fellowship with other teachers on this site than I have with many of the ones close to me geographically. I think that �s because we all share a common aim, to improve our teaching and share our ideas etc.
I �m not denying that it might very well have been an even friendlier and even more welcoming site before, but here are some of the ways in which I have found the site to be friendly and welcoming to (relatively) new members like myself:
- every time I have posted a query on the forum I have had useful and friendly replies, even though I know people surely have a lot of other things to do besides answering my question. Soon after I joined and asked about how to improve my students � listening skills, many members went so far as to send me PMs with their ideas and one was good enough to send me a long list of links and downloadable shared material. Similarly, just the other day when I had a query about phonics transcription, one member was good enough to not only reply to my original post but to also reply to my barrage of follow-up PMs with useful and friendly advice and support.
- on one ocassion when I was trying to figure out how to reduce the size of images I was looking back through past posts and saw that a certain moderator had offered to send a PM with an explanation to someone who was asking a similar question. I e-mailed her and even though she had no idea who I was and had had no previous contact with me whatsoever, she was very generous in sharing her expertise with me.
- on a number of times when I have sent members PMs about small typos in their worksheets, they have always been good enough to repsond to my PMS, and on some occasions have even sent me the edited version of the worksheet in question and, a couple of times, extra worksheets for me to use, too
- Sometimes my computer has not immediately accepted files with lots of graphics. On these occasions the members in question have always been good enough to e-mail me their printables when I requested them to do so.
- I always like to have an answer key and usually ask for one if I have any doubt in my mind. Even though I �m sure it �s a lot of trouble for members to make an answer key just for me as such, people have always either answered my specific doubts or made and sent me an answer key.
- I have personally felt very encouraged by people �s comments on my worksheets.
In all these ways I do feel that this site is (still) a friendly and supportive site, though, as I mentionned before, I have no idea if it may have been a friendlier or more supportive site before.
I would also like to take this opportunity to say that I very much respect members like Katiana, Evelina, Vanda, Alenka, Gabitza and all the others whose names I �m afraid I don �t know who (though I have never checked) surely must have more than enough points that in fact they never need to upload another worksheet or pp again, but have continued to do so in the spirit of sharing that they believe in despite the fact that other members have abused their privelige and made use of all/ parts of their printables without permission.
Just my thoughts on the matter, but hope it gives you the perspective of one of the newer members of the site.
I sincerely hope we can all continue to share, support and help each other and that everyone is enjoying a good week.
Hugs from Japan,
Julia |
21 Jan 2010
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Carla Horne
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Hello Everyone,
I must agree with Brunadutra because I know that I feel differently since the AFS case. I was never suspicious of anyone here before this case, and now I worry that some of the wss that are being copied from members are also being sent to the publisher who is hurting us. This thread has helped me realize that I am being ridiculous: I can �t stop him and being suspicious only hurts me.
Zailda is also right in that we have grown so much just in the short time that I have been here that change is inevitable. True, it is Victor �s site, and only he can make the rules, but I implore him to really think about restructuring them. I mentioned this today on the Abuse page, but no one has replied; so I �ll try again.
I don �t ask my students to create their own illustrations when they are doing serious research, but I do demand that they have a Works Cited page and use parenthetical notes. Since we basically research which photos or clip art would go with a text, why can �t we just follow the rules for researching? We do NOT make money off our work, so why not just cite our sources. Of course, if you are good enough to generate money from your wss, then you will need to either create, buy, or use public domain illustrations. I just think that this approach could save us a lot of headaches about the clipart.
I hope that I have not offended anyone. I would just like to make things easier.
Carla
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21 Jan 2010
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Bruna Dutra
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Of course not... no one hear has given me more attention than you, especially for disagreeing with me! 
I do not want to change you, and I have already told you that I do not want to change anyone in here, but as a community, we cannot act as we please, and I know you agree with me on that.
We can be whatever we want in the comfort of our house, but I do not agree when people say "my education depends on yours", I think either you are educated or you are not. Education doesn �t depend on anything. That �s my personal view of life and people.
And to answer your question, nothing should be reason enough for attacking. I am always pro to discussions, never arguments. Having a strong personality, I tend to lose control in arguments, and do not gain anything from them, nor I get to say what I wanted. To sum up, I never see the good of a fight. Nevertheless, I cannot do nothing about it. Go figure!!! hehehehe
Hugs from the South!!
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21 Jan 2010
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Bruna Dutra
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Oooooops... typo! No one *HERE, dear Zailda
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21 Jan 2010
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zailda
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Bruna, what I wanted to say is that instead of attacking and them telling the person to be nice and don �t attack back, why to attack first? What �s the aim of criticizing and remarking people?
If no one attacks a person here, people like me (and I guess I �m not the only one) will be nice too. If someone starts a war, why do they complain if the other person continues it? Isn �t it wiser not to start it?
I agree that we shouldn �t disturb the others starting threads that may distune the atmosphere we want here, but when someone starts one, and my name is mentioned, why should I think on preserving the atmosphere (that has already been disturbed)?
I agree that we can do anything we want in our private lives, but the members power to tell us what to do goes up to the rules. If we are not infringing the rules, each one deals things the way it �s his natural way or reacting.
As we have already said, if we want respect from others, we have to respect as well. I don �t understand people who disrespect and want respect back. They aren �t nice at all but want us to be. How? They start a long speech on "good manners, treating people with respect" and use this speech - that could be nice in other context - to attack someone. So they attack defending the right to be treated with respect.
I ask people to be consistent and coherent or we won �t understand their point. If you say something and act differently, I �ll never get your point. (It �s not your case, just generalizing).
How can a person participate in a forum, if he says one thing in one thread and a different one on the other? If his opinion varies according to his interests?
So , in the name of the peace and kindness on the site, I �ll attack someone personally... A good start, don �t you think?
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21 Jan 2010
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maoopa
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OMG Zailda...
In the name of peace, no one mentioned your name until you started mentioning mine.
BTW, I have not seen any support for your point. Are you willing to show me where it is?
Without any trace of hate or revenge, just take a breath and consider other �s points of view as valid. I do not have to believe what you say, this is not religion.
Happy teaching everyone,
Mauro |
21 Jan 2010
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Bruna Dutra
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@Zailda... I understand and agree with you. No one here has �fought � more for COHERENCE from the members. I �m not defending anyone, nor am I attacking, of course.
It is obviously not right to expose someone personally, for whatever reason. If things are like that, we can all go back to the time where people were judged (in first instance) in a public square where everyone could see who they are and blah blah blah. A real progress wouldn �t you say?!
Again... somethings are really wrong. For example, I did not get why some members gave that guy Mauro a hard time for posting a link to his website, people share links to other sites all the time... was it because he is the owner? Does he do this repeatedly? I �m actually asking, I do not know. Because how can we know other members are not somehow connected to the websites the share on the forum? It �s controversial bahavior for me. But, I �m not omniscient too! hhehehehe Maybe I lack information.
We should aaaaaall chill a little, I guess.
Like Julia has pointed out... there �s good in here, and mostly. We just are failing to see it. And like Carla has spoken, sometimes, we are being ridiculous because we are wasting our time more with the bad rather than with the good!
Well, well. I wish you do not get your feelings hurt, and being who you are, I really wish you can be the better man in whatever you did not like (I supposed you were talking about something I �m not aware of... because I couldn �t understand everything.)
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21 Jan 2010
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juliag
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PS
I don �t know quite what went on before having only read what went on in these posts, but I must say really don �t know where these outrageous accusations of "hate" and "revenge" suddenly appeared from.
It is apparent to me and should be to everyone else that Zailda has no thoughts of hatred and revenge whatsoever. She is simply responding to what would seem to be personal comments made about her on this public forum (which is surely not the place for it, isn �t that why we have PM?) in a logical and considered way, which is surely her right?
Although I really don �t see why shee should be forced to defend herself in public like that in the first place. By posting personal comments about people on this public forum we are not only being disrespectful to them we are degrading ourselves.
Let �s all have a bit more respect for both ourselves and others and think before we put our mouths (keyboards) into action.
Sincerely
Julia
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21 Jan 2010
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